TiVo shows Series3 HDTV Cable Card unit at CES

Posted on Thursday, January 5, 2006 by MegaZone

ATTN: The original image links are getting swamped – so if you have trouble, there are a number of full and partial mirrors listed here. And I’m open to anyone else mirroring.
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Sorry for the delay, I got a later start today than I’d hoped, my bad. I went straight to TiVo’s booth and I’ve been here for a while now, looking around and taking photos. I got a personal tour from TiVoPony of all the new stuff, most of which I can share. :-) Through the marvel of unsecured WiFi I’m coming to you from their booth. The biggest thing they have on display is the Series3 box. The Series3 is the CableCARD HDTV unit, which is due out in mid-to-late 2006. And let me tell you, it is a *SHARP* looking box! Very sleek design, very nice. I have photos, I’ll get them up ASAP, but I didn’t want to wait to post.

The unit has two CableCARD slots on the back and it will support Multi-Stream or Single-Stream cards. If you have multi-stream then you only need one card, but as long as only single stream cards are available you can use two of them. Yes, the unit is dual-tuner – actually, like the HD DirecTiVo it can use any two of the tuners it has, and it has six. 2 cable tuners, 2 ATSC tuners, and 2 NTSC tuners. Yes, it supports digital and analog cable, digital ATSC OTA, and analog NTSC OTA.

The only inputs the unit has are a coax cable in and a coax antenna in. There are no RCA or S-Video inputs on this unit. For output it has HDMI, Component Video, S-Video, and Composite Video. It has optical digital audio out, as well as RCA stereo out. Like the Series2 units it has 2 USB ports, and it also has a 10/100baseT Ethernet jack built-in. The unit also still has the modem, which seems increasingly archaic. :-) Oh, yeah, I almost forgot – it also has an external SATA port. ;-)

The unit has front panel controls clustered on the right, and a nice display in the middle with a very cool feature – it displays the title of the show(s) tuned at the time, so you always know what it is recording at a glance. There is also an output indicator that indicates if the unit is outputting in 480i, 480p, 720p, or 1080i – and it can be set to any of those. It can also be set to pass-through, so it will send the shows to the TV in whatever format they were received.

The remote ls also sleeker – a slick update of the Series2 peanut with minor changes for HDTV (such as an aspect button). But the big change is that the remote is backlit! It is also weighted and has a ridged pattern on the back towards the base, so there is VERY distinct tactile feedback as to having the remote the right way around in your hand. So those who dislike the peanut because of the ambiguity should be happy.

The box unit still encodes analog content as MPEG2, like the current units, but it supports playback of advanced codecs such as MPEG4 AVC/H.264. This will open up the possibilities of broadband content using more efficient codecs, including HD downloads.

The photos are currently uploading to http://www.gizmolovers.com/Photos/CES2006/ – I’ll fix the permissions as soon as they’re all up so you can see them. Warning, they’re HUGE since they’re 5 mega pixels, I don’t have time to make thumbnails at the moment. I’ll do that later – I noticed some of them are a bit blurry, I’ll take some more and upload those as well.

Oh, and remember that SATA port? TiVo will also be selling an external SATA drive for easy storage expansion, and they have that on display here too.

I have more, I’ll post it in a moment. :-)

EDIT: To clarify, it supports analog cable, even any digital cable channels sent in the clear, without CableCARD. You only need CableCARD for any protected digital channels, to handle the descryption. And since all digital cable systems in the US *must* support CableCARD – it is an FCC mandate – then it should work with all cable systems, analog or digital.

I also got a bit more info, the chipset used in the Series2 supports VC-1 (aka WMV9) and MPEG-4 AVC/H.264, along with MPEG-2, so it has all the same codecs as HD-DVD or Blu-ray. When I asked if it was using a Broadcomm chip I was told that would be a good guess.

There is also another URL for the photos: http://www.gizmolovers.com.nyud.net/Photos/CES2006/ – and if anyone else wants to mirror them, please feel free – just give me some credit. If you want to repost them in your own blog, site, etc – please COPY them to your server, don’t kill mine. :-)

As for price – nothing has been announced yet, that’s still To Be Determined.

I have more photos which I’ll be uploading shortly.

EDIT 2: Oh, one other tech detail I forgot. The S3 is still using IDE drives internally, only the external drive is SATA. Also, the external drive is not removable in the conventional sense. Once it is connected, the OS makes it part of the file system and shows may be recorded using both the internal and external drive – as in the SAME show may have its bits scattered on both. If you disconnect the external drive the unit will cope with it, but any shows recorded with any data on the external drive will vanish. So it isn’t something you connect, record to, then take to another unit to watch the shows.

As for CPU, RAM, etc. I don’t have that info yet, but I’ll ask.

Anything else? :-)

EDIT 3: See this entry for more info on the photos – more uploads and mirrors. Also, to permalink to this post, use this as the best direct link.

EDIT 4: Greetings Slashdotters. :-)

EDIT 5: To clarify, the Series3 WILL NOT support CableCARD 2.0. It is strictly a unidirectional device. It will support CableCARD 1.0 and MultiStream, but NOT 2.0/bidirectional. The earlier content that suggested it would was the result of a miscommunication.
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ATTN: The original image links are getting swamped – so if you have trouble, there are a number of full and partial mirrors listed here. And I’m open to anyone else mirroring.

About MegaZone

MegaZone is the Editor of Gizmo Lovers and the chief contributor. He's been online since 1989 and active in several generations of 'social media' - mailing lists, USENet groups, web forums, and since 2003, blogging.    MegaZone has a presence on several social platforms: Google+ / Facebook / Twitter / LinkedIn / LiveJournal / Web.    You can also follow Gizmo Lovers on other sites: Blog / Google+ / Facebook / Twitter.
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  • krellis

    My HD TiVo lust just got worse! You bastard! Steal one! :)

  • rogueonion_8

    Great post. Thanks for the update!

  • ertyu

    Too bad it won’t support satellite or non cablecard cable systems. Otherwise impressive.

  • joezollo

    I cannot get the pictures to load.

  • anonymous

    You had the scoop, man! Great job!

  • megazone

    I guess I wasn’t clear – it supports analog cable, even any digital cable channels sent in the clear, without CableCARD. You only need CableCARD for any protected digital channels, to handle the descryption. And since all digital cable systems in the US *must* support CableCARD – it is an FCC mandate – then it should work with all cable systems, analog or digital.

  • anonymous

    Is that a disk usage indicator to the right of the show title?

  • megazone

    Nope, that’s the aspect indicatior:

    480i
    480p
    720p
    1080i

  • wickerdotus

    Awesome post.

    Thanks for taking the time to type up everything, and include the photos too. I know what is at the top of my list for Christmas 2006!

  • krellis

    Try the coralized version of the link:

    http://www.gizmolovers.com.nyud.net/Photos/CES2006/

    If enough people use it, it should cache everything and let the load off MZ’s server.

  • anonymous

    Thanks for posting the pics and a wonderful summary! I can’t wait!

    Alex
    http://www.tivoblog.com

  • avacon

    Thanks for writing this up. I can’t wait!

  • ertyu

    You were clear. No svideo or composite inputs, means no external black box tuners. Up here in Canada Cablecard is still an unknown. And you can’t use it with satellite systems either.

  • credendovides

    This may be the TiVo that gets me to ditch DirecTV. Not that I’ve had any complaints with the DirecTV service directly, but turning their back on TiVo in favor of their own crappy DVR means people like me get left behind on all these snazzy new features like TiVoToGo, HME, and all that fun stuff. (Not that I’d get them anyway, given that I’m still using S1.)

    I wonder if I’ll need to make any MFS Tools changes to support S3.

  • anonymous

    Would you already know, or could you ask them, if they have tested this unit in any of the areas where DirecTV has started delivering their new satellite services?

    Thanks.

  • buran

    It looks interesting. Now I know that when I get a flatpanel TV these will be around. Question is, will it be worth bothering immediately or not? Maybe not, unless there is a visible difference with HD devices and Charter’s cable services in St. Louis.

  • anonymous

    OK, how do you have two tuners if you only have one cable coax input? Do you use the antenna input as well with a splitter, or does it actually split the signal after it comes into the cable coax input?

    Can you tell I don’t have the dual tuner DirecTivo?

  • megazone

    The new box doesn’t work with satellite at all, so I’m not sure what you’re asking.

  • megazone

    Unlike DirecTV, which needs two connections from the dish to the box, cable and antenna signals are all-in-one, so it splits them internally.

  • wc

    Do your cable boxes not have Coax output?

  • megazone

    He’s right – the new box doesn’t support IR blasters or serial. It is not designed to be used with any external tuner, cable or satellite.

  • ertyu

    I forgot about coax, pretty low quality option, but ya, no IR blaster or serial either.

  • anonymous

    These are some great features, however if Tivo wants to get some serious cheers, they MUST be sure the RJ-45 port is operable AND a Gigabit one!!! This would facilitate the necessary bandwidth for these larger HD files and allow home networking enthusiasts to further leverage the benefits of TivoToGo across their Gigabit networks :)

    Therefore, if you are having additional conversation with them, please be sure they understand the importance as this additional small change as it is sorely needed.

  • megazone

    It came up in conversation already actually, but 100baseT should be fast enough even for HD file transfers. Keep in mind that to really use a GigE port the entire unit would have to be beefy enough – not only the Ethernet port and chipset, but the system bus, CPU, etc, all need to be powerful enough to sustain high speed traffic – AND handle the other system tasks like recording. So it impacts the entire system.

  • anonymous

    Good points and if they can stomach the other changes, it would be yet another feather in their hat to include Gigabit functionality!! Also, has the Tivo “Contingent” considered plumbing the Series3 units to support IPTV as that is being rapidly deployed by some of the Telcos through their Fiber Deployments???

  • wc

    wow. that would limit their usefulness then… I’m not sure how I feel about that… Perhaps they will still make/sell series 2 boxes for areas that don’t support cable card.

  • megazone

    I know broadband content is a big deal with this box, but nothing was said about IPTV in particular. I’ll ask tomorrow.

  • megazone

    Keep in mind TiVo only officially sells units in the US – and the entire US requires CableCARD for digital cable. So there are no areas without it. If you don’t have CableCARD, you don’t have digital cable – and if you have analog cable or antenna, this box has you covered.

    Now, if/when they official launch product into Canada, they may need to do something different for digital cable.

    But the Series2 boxes aren’t going away when this comes out, this is a higher end product and the Series2 will remain as a lower cost unit. They may get a refresh, but TiVo wouldn’t say anything concrete.

  • loganx3d

    Two questions for tomorrow if you have time:

    a) Does it still require a landline to activate the unit, or can it be activated directly through the network (i.e., can those of us with just cellphones use the Series 3)?

    b) Does it record in MPEG-2 still, or MPEG-4/H.264?

    Thanks!

  • megazone

    a) Even Series2 units no longer need a landline. 7.2 introduced network Guided Setup out of the box, and this unit would be the same way.

    b) Actually I answered this in my original post. :-) NTSC antenna or analog cable will be encoded as MPEG-2, as with current TiVos. ATSC or digital cable will be saved as-is, in whatever format it is transmitted in – which today is MPEG-2 for both, though we may see MPEG-4 on digital cable at some point. Broadband content is more likely to use MPEG-4.

  • anonymous

    Will the CC 2.0 cards this box accepts allow for PPV and VoD, or is it just for multistreaming? (not complaining, just wondering)

  • anonymous

    Any word on whether the Series3 will have a PIP feature now that it will have dual tuners? I noticed when looking at your remote pictures that the Window button on the Series2 has been replaced by the Aspect button.

  • megazone

    I can ask for a clarification on this tomorrow. But the impression I got today was that it is just for multi-stream support at this time, but supporting CC2.0 would mean handling bidirectional communication, so it would probably be software for VOD/PPV/etc.

    I’ll make a note to ask specifically.

  • bugabuga

    One more thing :)
    Given that all TiVOs have USB port, did they think about cable box control via USB? :) Of course once the Echo generation of boxes is out and about it’s not actual but still… all Scientific Atlanta boxes support “USB Keyboard” mode. That is, if you connect to cable box the keyboard and tap key up, channel changes. Same for down and numeric keys. Beats IR interface any day and shouldn’t really be that hard to implement.
    Also, it would allow using external box for cases when “extra super premium” service is not cable card compatible :)

    Thanks for the pictures!

  • megazone

    Hmm, I don’t think so – but I’ll ask.

  • megazone

    Most cable boxes don’t officially support USB control, so TiVo hasn’t done it. But I hadn’t heard about the keyboard trick, that’s interesting.

    And you’re welcome. :-)

  • anonymous

    you imply a speed increase with the phrase “100baseT should be fast enough” has TiVo talked about speed of TTG or MRV with these units? Has there been any demo of transfers to give a subjective impression of ?

    PS thanks for the from the floor reporting of all this. It is great to get this firsthand from someone with the background to convey it all!

  • megazone

    No demos, they only have one working HD unit wired up – the one I photographed is (as seen in the photos) only connected to power – there is one connected to a display nearby too. Word is they intend to support MRV and TTG, but you won’t be able to MRV HD content to an SD TiVo – they can’t handle it. And TiVo is still sorting out what the DRM rules will have to be for TTG for things recorded under CableCARD – they need to obey the rules from Cable Labs. But I wouldn’t worry too much about that, they’re not draconian.

  • bugabuga

    I’d have to disagree ;) Scientific Atlanta’s support of USB keyboard is even in some manuals (see SA 3250HD Interactive Set Top Features List [PDF]). Motorola boxes simply specify “keyboard” in the list of the features. Point is, regular users don’t need USB keyboard to change the channels, but both major manufacturers seem to have it. I can attest to Sci Atl doing it for years :) So I’d presume any set top with USB port on it has it primarily for the keyboard (and wet dreams of “tons of interactive features”). Old style analog-only boxes don’t support anything :)

  • megazone

    You know, I really didn’t expect to ‘have the scoop’. Since I overslept and then took my time getting over the convention center, I figured the news would be everywhere. I was *shocked* to find, after I’d posted, that it seems no one else had even mentioned the Series3! Let alone post any photos of it. I’ve even had a national publication ask to use one of my photos.

    I’m just blown away and laughing my ass off about this. Little TiVoLovers breaking the news. Heh!

  • anonymous

    Does this support QAM, so that you can get in the clear HD channels?

  • anonymous

    HAlf the country is on Satellite and this box (series 3) won’t work with them? What is wrong with this pix?

  • megazone

    It has to support QAM for digital cable in general, so yes. And my understanding is that it would handle in the clear channels without a CableCARD. But I’ll confirm that.

  • anonymous

    USB is not a symmetrical Bus. Chances are both the STB and the Tivo
    expect to be the master…..

  • megazone

    True, but isn’t it possible for a master to emulate a device in software? I thought that was the idea behind things like USB-on-the-go and such, or does it take special HW too?

  • megazone

    Nothing at all is wrong with the picture. The only way to support satellite would be with an external tuner, and you couldn’t do any better than the Series2 can today. Since the Series2 isn’t going away, why add cost to this box just to support satellite?

    Especially since it is more like a quarter of the TV viewers on satellite, and most of those who opt for a DVR will take one of the models offered by their provider for basically free at this point.

  • justingn

    To be honest, while the SATA port is more than a welcome addition to the TiVo box (My mom has already filled her Humax DVD Burner Series 2 up!), the way Tivo actually uses the external hard disk seems sort of like a step backwards to me. I mean, it’s not RAID per se, but the way it works, it does sound like a striped RAID array. And frankly, doing that with an external drive just sounds silly. But on the other hand, you do have to keep the content providers nice and happy (and rolling in dough), so I guess something like that is to be expected.

    A shame. Any word on if the external drive will be user servicable? (IE, can we drop a 500 gigger in it if we so choose?)

  • megazone

    I hit the last question in another reply – TiVo is hoping to allow users to buy any SATA drive that meets some minimum spec, but it remains to be seen how it works out in the real world.

  • anonymous

    I didn’t see any mention of the native capacity of the hard drive. What size drive comes standard and how much recording time will it have right out of the box?

    captain_video

  • craigeagle

    What is the recording capacity of the Series3? Is that decided yet?
    – Craig

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